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Tuesday, 30 March 2010

Why We Should Reject Rick Warren's Purpose Driven and PEACE Agenda

Continuing on from my post entitled "Tony Blair Faith Foundation, Rick Warren PEACE agenda and One World Political Religious Government".

I write this new post because I am SO concerned about the bad influence Rick Warren is having on the global Christian church. Please watch this video first, which is Rick's united faith message at a meeting chaired by Tony Blair  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RkumUYaxl0s


I will give you a number of other links (at the bottom) which show conclusively why Rick Warren and Purpose Driven are heresy, ecumenical and therefore influenced by the Vatican.  

Why do I say that ecumenical = Vatican? 


Well: here are two documents direct from the Vatican which show they were the first behind the ecumenical movement and that they actually control it.
http://www.cin.org/v2ecum.html

http://www.vatican2voice.org/6unity/ecumenism.htm


Incidentally, here is a link which shows why the Catholic Church is a false religion and not part of the true church.


http://watchmanforjesus.blogspot.com/2010/03/why-catholic-church-is-not-christian.html

By the way, if you are interested I could also give you evidence which shows that Rick often lies or exaggerates. That is, he states things as fact which are not and he misquotes from the bible continuously. He only uses scriptures (misapplied and wrongly interpreted) to back up his arguments and if the bible does not help him he uses the heretical paraphrase translation "the message" or other paraphrases (paraphrases are simply a single man's interpretation - not a translation) to make his point, which shows he cannot be trusted.


Regarding his PEACE plan. Rick Warren does seem (on the face of it) to be fulfilling the role of antichrist or false prophet (as described within the Book of Revelation). But, he is probably not THE antichrist (but possibly could be a prophet for him or forerunner). The word antichrist actually means "in the place of Christ" not just opposed, but imitating and counterfeiting Christ. Jesus will return and set up His kingdom of peace on Earth but there will be NO peace until the prince of peace (Jesus) rules on the Earth.


However, Rick Warren believes that he can set up peace globally through his PEACE program, without the prince of peace. This is why he is so anxious to work with Tony Blair's Faith organisation. In fact I have a video link included which shows Tony Blair being influenced by Rick Warren. 


Now as promised all the other links which prove Rick Warren and Purpose Driven as ecumenical, false, cultish, unbiblical and dangerous to the true faith once handed down to us:


These expose Purpose Driven and Rick Warren:
http://moriel.org/MorielArchive/index.php/discernment/church-issues/ecumenism/purpose-driven-ecumenism
http://moriel.org/MorielArchive/index.php/discernment/catholicism/purpose-driven-and-the-catholic-church

Please note that I am in the process (as led by God) of  putting an article together which summarises the main points and shows how Rick Warren twists the scriptures. I will compare what Rick says with what the scriptures ACTUALLY say regarding God's purposes for us and HIS kingdom. Please watch this space.


Late Additions
Earlier, I  wrote an article showing how blasphemous the bible paraphrase "The Message" is. Please note that this "bible" is overly used in quotations by Rick throughout the "Purpose Driven Life" to make his point. See:
Showing Why The Bible Version "The Message" Is Blasphemous  which proves the point.


I have (also) now written a later article which covers some of these things. Please click on: 

Information On The Seeker-Friendly Movement and Its Links, Why It Arose and How It Has Fallen From Biblical Christianity.

24 comments:

Tony Cox said...

Hi John,

I realize you have other things going on in your life - but I am glad to see your back!

I missed you!

Wary said...

Hello John

Robinswood 'One church'makes more of Bill Hybels Willow Creek, which I understand was begun by Rick Warren for 'seeker sensitive'. One pastor I spoke to gave me the impression he didn't think it as bad as P.D. (I could be wrong about that?) So I wonder if this should be looked at as well?

John Chingford said...

Thanks Tony for your warm welcome

John Chingford said...

Hi Wary,

When I find time I will write about Bill Hybell, Willow Creek, Seeker Sensitive etc.

Just for now I will say that from what I remember, Purpose Driven came out of the seeker friendly approach. Certainly they are linked. Out of These two came the emerging church which Rick Warren praises and endorses.

Rick Warren's marketing approach to Christianity came from approaching new age gurus. So new age, purpose Driven, seeker friendly and emerging church are all linked together.

Please see this video which covers all of this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UtxzD-Rh_9M&feature=PlayList&p=69BA21BE82E2E67C&index=14&playnext=8&playnext_from=PL

Mr E said...

I think you were rather OTT in yesterday's piece. I haven't had much exposure to Rick Warren or his Purpose-Driven agenda, so no axe to grind, but to anathemise him by a mild association with Tony Bliar and hence to Popery was rather strong!

Some of the linked articles (I didn't read them all) come from a place of rather dubious theology and make great leaps in their interpretation of the Bible to try to prove a point.

(For instance the stance that the churches in Revelation 2-3 represent ages of the church and therefore the church must be lukewarm before Jesus returns; leading to a conclusion that any revival or Church growth in the last days must be unscriptural - sorry but that's bordering on heresy to me).

God bless

John Chingford said...

Hi Mr E,

If you listened to the short video of Rick Warren's PEACE agenda (a meeting chaired by Tony Blair) and the video I sent before of Tony Blairs agenda for uniting faiths and the article that shows that the two are working together with each other, you will see that the relationship is NOT a MILD association.

The guys are working together on the same agenda for world Peace by uniting all faiths.

This is serious stuff as the book of Revelation (and many other scriptures) talks about a man of peace who rises to power by using a global religious system. The man of peace being the ac.

We know Tony Blair's desire to be the president of the EU. His ambitions seem to have no end and Rick Warren speaks glowingly about Tony Blair.

If any churches follow Rick Warren's agenda they are participating in the sins of the apostate which Revelation tells us not to do.

Most Christian organisations are being influenced by PD and subsequently Emerging Church (because RW endorses it).

You should not say that you are not affected by it because it is all around us now. "Come out of Babylon".

I would rather not get into a debate (here) about interpretations of Revelation. All I am doing is to alert everybody (through a conviction I have from God) of things that I believe will affect us ALL NOW in these days.

By the way, Heresy is denying Jesus as the only way to God, denying that salvation from our sins is by grace alone by the death and resurrection of Jesus etc etc.

It is not heresy to simply state an interpretation (from the Book of Revelation) whether there will be revivals or apostasy in the end times.

However, Rick Warren calling the Catholic church christian, promoting Catholics and being unequally yoked with those in darkness (ie other faiths) in the way that Rick does, IS heresy.

For example catholics deny the essential things about Jesus, relying on works for their salvation and preaching that you need to go through purgatory etc. These teachings of catholics ARE heresy.

John Chingford said...

Mr E, are you suggesting that the church growth explosion we see today proves that revival is prophesied in the bible during the last days?

I like most believers welcome revival and do not dismiss that there could be some form of revival in the last days. But any revival must be from God and not instigated by man.

Jesus said I (not men) will build my church. Acts says the Lord (not men) added to the church daily those who were being saved.

Any church growth MUST be a revival of the Holy Spirit and WILL be bible based.

Problem is that church leaders (being desperate for revival) have sought worldly means to achieve it. They say that they welcome any means that will bring in church growth. So what we see happening is MAN@S ideas and Man's programs bringing about church growth through giving the people what they want rather than what they need.

In the marketing world they say "give the people what they want - not what they need", ie supply/demand principles.

The bible however, states the opposite that man is lost, sinful and hellbound and NEED to be saved regardless of whether they WANT this or not, this is what we MUST preach.

We must preach the truth regardless of whether people join the church or desert it.

By doing this then if there is church growth full of born-again saved believers then it MUST be all of God doing, rather than man, because the sinful nature of man does not want to be told that he needs a saviour.

Tony Cox said...

Certainly do not mean to offend Mr. E - but I must echo, that Rick Warren's association with Tony Blair is not a mild one.

With all the news references we have recently concerning this relationship, I would ask not in the spirit of conflict, but in truth - as I am genuinely interested as to how you view this as mild.

Tony Cox said...

John,

Hate to beat a dead horse here, but just saw this posted today on Blair - I guess it should not surprise me he is trying to get Jewish people ivolved also - this guy is going full steam:

Tony BLAIR is to become the latest high-profile figure to be quizzed by readers of the Jewish News.

Just one week after calling for the resumption of negotiations between Israel and the Palestinians during an address to the AIPAC conference in
Washington, the former prime minister is inviting readers to submit their questions regarding his role as the international community's Middle East envoy.

He will also tackle questions on the work of the Tony Blair Faith
Foundation, established in 2008 to promote understanding about the world's
major religions. Key projects of the Foundation include enabling children
worldwide to get to know each other through video conferencing discussions
and a campaign using interfaith activity to raise awareness and funds to
reduce malaria deaths.

Blair told the Jewish News: "Since the launch of my Faith Foundation, my
team and I have worked closely with the Jewish community, most notably
Tzedek at the Jewish Social Action Hub, sponsored by the Pears Foundation.
We also support Jewish-led initiatives such as Project Muso and Mitzvah Day.

"There are many other ways we can work together and I welcome your readers'
thoughts. I am glad to be engaging with the Jewish News and look forward to
answering questions about how interfaith work can help us make the case that
faith can be a positive force in the world. And please feel free to also ask
me questions on my role as Quartet Representative to the Middle East."

Blair, who said last week he regarded himself as "a true friend" of both
Israelis and Palestinians, has served as the Quartet's envoy since leaving
Downing Street in 2007 and is charged with helping the Palestinians to
prepare for statehood as part of the international community's effort to
secure peace.

News of this opportunity to quiz Blair comes one week after the Jewish News
hosted the fourth in its series of face-to-face question and answer sessions
with leading political figures, when William Hague took the hot seat last
Monday. Jewish News editor Richard Ferrer said: "We're pleased to offer the
chance to quiz another leading figure. With the Middle East and interfaith
relations, Mr Blair is addressing two key issues facing us today."

Mr E said...

I'm afraid that Tony Bliar makes my skin creep, so I prefer not to see him more than I need to! I'll take your word about the content.

By the way "Babylon" may or may not be Roman Catholicism - that's just an interpretation - I could give you others.

Incidentally, quite a few source define "heresy" as any departure from the dogma Roman Catholic church - we all stand accused!

The word itself is a direct transliteration from the Greek meaning "to be factious". So I'd better stop digging this particular hole!

God bless

John Chingford said...

Hi Mr E

Thanks for your gracious reply. I know that Babylon = Roman Catholicism is an interpretation because the bible does not specifically state the name RC. Obviously it couldn't because it didn't exist in bible times as that name.

However, the evidence is VERY strong. The NEW Testament writers warned us in advance of what to expect with this Babylonic movement. The RC fulfil it in every way!

Please check out these videos which give conclusive evidence:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=toBOML5W4uQ&NR=1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ofpa6npXQoY&NR=1

as posted previously on my posts on the catholic church

John Chingford said...

Thanks Tony,

Re Tony Blair and his links with Jewish community - Very very interesting!

Does Tony want to be the ac? Everything he does seems to point to it.

Let's see!
So he wants to join all faith groups together and work with them.

Evidence is that he has aspirations to be a global president after not getting the EU presidency.

He wants to be a "man of peace" who works with his "prophet" Rick Warren (the false prophet prophesied?).

He now wants to show his support for Israel and all nations.

If everything goes the way he plans, Israel could look to him as a messiah figure.

Personally, I find it hard to believe that Tony Blair is the ac, but he does seem to follow the credentials. Hmmm, let's watch this space.

John Chingford said...

BTW, the AIPAC conference in
Washington is a conference attended by pro Israel supporters. Bob Mitchell has put an excellent posting on his site showing Netanyahu's speech at the conference, on video.

I recommend you watch it. I have never heard Netanyahu speak so openly before about his patriotism, plans and hopes for Israel. If only he showed that same confidence in front of the most powerful political leaders.

Mr E said...

John,
Don't mind if I don't watch the clips in full - I really don't like the lurid illustrations.

I'm quite familiar with identification of Babylon with Rome or the Roman Catholic church - the latter started shortly after the Reformation and has been recurrent since then.

Does it apply? Well, I would say it does to a degree, but we need to be careful about trying to make prophecy fit current events.

Revelation was written for a first century audience and was intended for them first. Unlike Daniel's prophecy it wasn't "sealed" for later generations, but was intended as a comfort and a warning to the churches of what was "soon to take place".

Unless we anchor the prophecy in its original context, any further interpretation is likely to be fanciful.

How would the first-century audience have understood this passage? Compare Rev 18:24 with Matthew 23:35. Where is being talked about? Is it not Jerusalem?

John is writing about events shortly to take place, and Jesus prophesied to "this generation" about the impending day of judgement, ruin of Jerusalem, destruction of the temple and scattering of the Jewish remnant which occurred in 70AD.

Contemporary historical accounts describe how Jesus' prophecy was fulfilled to the letter and was nothing short of cataclysmic.

This is how these passages have been interpreted throughout the history of the church, only recently being given a "modern" revision.

Who is the whore of Rev 17-18? I would suggest that the original context was a corrupt and apostate priesthood allied to Rome (although Jerusalem itself is built on seven hills, incidentally).

It is mentioned the purple and scarlet being like the dress of RC cardinals - but what about the jewels? Where did the RC get its inspiration for dressing up its "priests"?

Check Exodus 28 - you'll find the same colours and the jewels there. This is how Ananas and Caiaphas would have dressed when condemning Jesus on the testimony of one witness - breaking their Law, and when they led the people in saying "we have no king but Caesar".

(By the way, I disagree with the later date for Revelation because the church would have already experienced times of great trouble by then, and surely reference would have been made to it).

Is there a two-stage fulfillment to these chapters of Revelation?

Possibly, and I'm prepared to say that I think so and there is potential for them to apply to apostate religion that superficially seems to serve God, but is in reality at odds with His purpose.

For that reason I would hold the RC church as a possible candidate, just as I would any restoration of Jewish temple worship without recognition of Jesus.

John Chingford said...

Exodus 28 does not mention exactly the same colours. It mentions 4 colours, blue, gold, purple, scarlet. Revelation does not mention BLUE. The cardinals do not wear blue, but purple and scarlet has its origins in Babylonic religion. Revelation wanted to make the distinction so that all (who were aware of the traditions in Babylonic religion) would understand what and who it was talking about.

Those who want to smokescreen that the whore of Revelation is the Vatican system only have one thing they can point to ie the 7 hills of Jerusalem. The book of Revelation was NOT discussing AD70 because most things the Book refers to have not yet taken place. Those who interpret it as being Jerusalem and the Jewish people must close their eyes when reading the rest of the bible. One thing in favour of the Jewish people of AD70 is that they never went back to idolatry after the return from Babylon. Whereas Revelation says that the whore was as idolatrous system, which we know the catholics are.

I could take you through many proofs and logical arguments from the scriptures that it could not possibly be talking about Jerusalem. In fact this is why the Jews were terribly persecuted over the centuries because of this interpretation that God had judged them and finished with them - hence the rise of anti-semitism.

Although the Jews were bad, their atrocities pale into insignificance when compared with what the Vatican have done, which much more matches the Revelation description.

Mr E said...

Just to note that "blue" in Exodus 28 can also be translated as "violet", but that doesn't really add or subtract anything.

As I said before, I accept the possibility that the RC system is included in a wider interpretation of Rev 17-18 (actually a little stronger, I strongly believe it is a major part).

Is it the only interpretation? In other words is the prophecy fulfilled only in the RC system? I think that is too narrow.

Like I said earlier, and sorry if you disagree, the original fulfilment was in the destruction of temple service in AD70; but there is a wider fulfilment in that "Babylon" is the codename for apostate religion that spans from the original Tower of Babel right through to the second coming.

I don't think you can apply every detail of those chapters to the Vatican system itself - nor do I accept that John was seeing something that had no application to his immediate situation and concern for his pastorate.

Like I've said before, the Vatican are part of a bigger conspiracy picture and that is what is represented here.

Incidentally, it should come as no surprise that the Babylonian system results in child molestation and other evils, as prevalent in the RC church (we don't hear the half of it) and all but condoned by the arch anti-semite Ratzinger.

It is wrong, wrong, wrong that this evildoer is being invited on a state visit to our country - I pray that his sins are found out and broadcast such that he is unable to come.

Through the likes of Bliar, yes this country is being sold out to the Babylonian system.

John Chingford said...

Thanks again Mr E, for your good reply. Thanks also for this great discussion.

In response I would just like to ask a further question.

1) You state that Exodus 28 could be translated as violet instead of blue. Are you sure about that?

Do you have a source?

In all the reputable versions it is translated as blue and also the other colours as red, purple and gold. (Indeed even the heretical "message" says blue. The amplified bible says blue too).

In fact I cannot find any version that does not state blue.

Besides, surely it would not repeat itself by giving another colour very similar to purple. To all intents and purposes violet and purple are the same?

Besides we know that blue is very important in the priesthood and to Israel. In many ways blue is their significant colour above red and purple, anyway.

Mr E said...

John, In answer to an earlier question,

I don't think there's any dispute there - in my book revival is a sovereign move of God and not something men can manipulate (other than through prayer).

It's something of an American phenomenon to call evangelism "revival", but to me that's a misappropriation.

I would also say that some things labelled as "revival" are not.

Revivals are distinct from mission and evangelism - neither of which should be denigrated - that's what we're called to do.

I also believe that the church will grow in the last days - like the rock cut from the mountain in Daniel - to fill the earth.

Church growth, arising from a move of the Holy Spirit, accompanied by genuine repentance is something we should look for, pray for and embrace.

John Chingford said...

Hi Mr E, again thanks for your reply.

you quote from Daniel chapter 2 about the rock cut out but not by human hands.

I have read that passage through and through many times, comparing it with other scriptures. Surely the passage DOES NOT indicate a specific end times global revival?

In the context, it seems to be talking about Jesus setting up His church on the Earth sometime DURING the individual empires mentioned, ie AD30.

This kingdom will NEVER end and will outlast all the kingdoms on the Earth. Ultimately it will not just outlast them but will bring them to an end by God's doing not man's action(violently?).

We know that Jesus will return and reign (with His church) on Earth for a thousand years. God says that we will rule over nations in that millennial kingdom. But beforehand God will pour out His wrath on the Earth.

So surely the crushing refers to the judgement of God followed by the thousand year reign?

Whenever the scriptures refers to God's reign on Earth, ultimate peace on Earth and the glory of the Lord covering the Earth it is talking about the same event, ie. Jesus physical reign on Earth with His church (which has been changed in an instance and transformed into the image of Christ, the mortal putting on the immortal. 1 Cor 15).

Surely Daniel 2 is not talking about a pre millennial global revival but a millennial one?

Wary said...

John
I have been listening to a past programme with Pastor Bob Dewaay being interviewed by Jan Markell on her U.S. radio programme "Olive Tree". Speaking about the Emergent debacle he said there are now Purpose Driven programmes involving ALL denominations, including Roman Catholic and SYNAGOGUES!

Truly galloping Ecumenism! Not only is the 'antichrist' emerging, so the 'false prophet' is also emerging from the 'sea' of humanity.
Maranatha!

Sue

Expected Imminently said...

Hello John

It occurs to me that it may be helpful to share with others a puzzle I have had to deal with over the past few months.

I was told by a Purpose Driven soul, that it was ‘bad’ for me to read so much Scripture. I was going too deep into doctrine and it would make me ill. The hint behind this was it would make me loopy.

I was dumbfounded at first; I couldn’t credit how a Christian could believe such a thing. I was left feeling bemused by this ‘accusation’ as we are encouraged to study doctrine; and one verse in particular is straight to the point.

1Timothy 4:13 “Till I come, give attendance to reading, to exhortation, to DOCTRINE.”

We are encouraged to study God’s Word.

2Timothy 2:15 “Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth”.

Recently I came to realise that this is just one of many of Rick Warren and Company’s twisting of Scriptures. By misquoting 2 Corinthians 3:6 they remove from the verse “…THE LETTER KILLETH, BUT THE SPIRIT GIVES LIFE.”

What better way to keep the sheep dumb and ignorant than to warn them off relying upon God’s Word in their daily walk of Faith in Jesus saying “Don’t read too much of the Bible, it will make you ill”!

What is ‘doctrine’? It is simply ‘teaching’. The Bible contains the Teaching of God, and with the guidance of The Holy Spirit we gradually come to know what The Lord wants us to know and understand.

All things Purpose Driven/ Seeker Sensitive/ Church Growth Movement/ Emergent/Word of 'Faith'--- are allegorizing Scripture to deceive and to support their apostate teachings. They have an idea, then find a Scripture, and by removing it from its context, use it to ‘Biblically’ support their heresy. Satan did the same thing to Jesus during the temptation in the wilderness. Matthew 4:1-11.

2Timothy 4:3 "For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear".

So what of 2Cor.3:6, what is GOD telling us in the entire context of this verse?


Let Us Reason

by Mike Oppenheimer

"* 2 Corinthians 3:6 (The letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life) is allegorized in its interpretation to mean that Scripture is a dead letter and only the Spirit is what is important. So we need to heed new and fresh words from the Spirit.

But this is not what the Apostle Paul is saying. Again if we read it in context (before and after the portion that is lifted out to mean something other than the author wrote) we find the true meaning.

2 Corinthians 3:6-8 “who also made us sufficient as ministers of the new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life. But if the ministry of death, written and engraved on stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of the glory of his countenance, which glory was passing away, how will the ministry of the Spirit not be more glorious?"

Paul is making a distinction between the Old Covenant written on stone and the New Covenant that is presented inside us by the Spirit. The old (the law) brought death, because no one could keep its directives, whereas the new brings life through the life-giving Spirit.

The letter (the law) killed because no one was able to keep it. It made us guilty, while the New Covenant sets us free from the condemnation of the law. The law was fulfilled in the only person who could have fulfilled it, the God/man Jesus Christ.

Now we have the spirit of God inside us all because of this new covenant that is superior to the old covenant."

http://www.letusreason.org/default.htm


John 8:32 “And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free”.

Sue

Tony Cox said...

Hi John,

I see Rick Warren is a member and participant of the World Economic Forum and The Council on Foreign Relations.

I have not seen too much about him recently but having affiliations with organizations like these - as well as others - and being a "buddy" of Tony Blair - it is a little concerning what ties and power this guy really has or will have.

John Chingford said...

Thanks Tony

I appreciate being updated with these sorts of information.

Yes, Rick is really getting his fingers in many pies. He fulfils the scripture that says "holds to a form of godliness but denies its power". He denies the power of God through watering down the truth of the gospel "For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God". 1 Cor:18, ie by denying Jesus as the only way to God and getting heavily involved in all faiths ecumenism and globalism, being chummy with the likes of McLaren etc he is doing just that "denying the power of the gospel"

John Chingford said...

I would go as far as to say that Rick and his cohorts have been (possibly) more instrumental in destroying the true spiritual life in churches globally than any other since the Dark ages of Christianity.

What makes this worse is that we have the Bible widely available, but during the Dark ages that wasn't the case and yet this guy has "taken in" and deceived such vast numbers of believers, so quickly.

It is amazing how quickly this thing has spread through "seeker friendly", Purpose Driven, experientialism, emerging church, ecumenism etc and is speedily reversing the churches back to the dark ages or something far worse.

It really distresses me to see the destruction of true spiritual life in our churches,seeing the abandonment of the Bible as ultimate authority and such openness (ignorance)to receiving occultic practices. What hurts more is that they do not seem remotely aware of what is happening to them.

When we try to point these things out to such believers they get angry with us, closing their ears.

All we can do is pray that God will open many eyes to these things and bring them out of such darkness before they all get sucked in. We need many to leave these churches and find each other in true fellowship to prepare us to go underground when persecution and Tribulation comes.